CVP309 vs CVP307 and American vs non-American versions

[willjohn]

As a Florida resident, I encountered severe hurricane damage including totaling my CVP75. So, when I get an insurance settlement, I plan to buy a replacement - probably a 307 or 309 and possibly a non-domestic one. I shall be considering the items I address below. Thought others might benefit from the comparisons when considering a purchase for USA usage.

According to Yamaha's charts, which I believe are for "Yamaha" rather than "Yamaha Corp. of America" Clavinovas, the CVP309 and CVP307 differ in only five ways. (If YCA versions of the 309 and 307 differ in other ways and/or you can clarify the "*Depending on the destination" items, please post such information.)

The 309 has a Natural Wood Keyboard vs the 307's Graded Hammer 3 keyboard; the 309 has a mounted 2HD/2DD Floppy Disk vs the 307's" *Depending on the destination"; the 309's height is 89.0cm vs 88.5cm for the 307; and they differ in available colors and price.

In addition, they both show "Smart Media (Included)" as "*Depending on the destination".

Please correct me if I'm wrong but from what I have been able to ascertain, "Yamaha Corp." CVP300 Series Clavinovas and "Yamaha Corporation of America" CVP300 Series ones also differ. YC versions have selectable voltage while YCA ones don't; The song books differ and I don't know how one gets a YCA one for a YC Clavinova since apparently YCA ones are dealer-installed; YCA says it won't honor YC warrantys; warranty terms and duration may also differ; you get local dealer support with YCA clavs; and prices differ.

[dalgety]

willjohn,

One additional difference worth mentioning - the 309 has two USB to device ports. The 307 has only one. You can read why this isn't a show stopper (along with other comparison discussions) here: http://www.cvpug.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=811

The "US version" is indeed installed (via floppy disc) by authorized YCA dealers. I have heard numerous different explainations of what the US version adds, but have never seen an authoritative enumeration of the differences. Those alleged (mostly by local salesmen) include:
1) the US version renames the built-in songs to use their actual titles, as opposed to "generic" titles, making the music finder more useful.
2) the US version adds additional "built-in" songs
3) the US version has a more intuitive onscreen interface
4) and my favorite is some variant of "It's just better - you definitely NEED the US version. YCA spent lots of money developing it. It's the best thing since sliced bread."

I believe #1 and #2 may be true. I've never understood #3, given that they don't swap out the manual for "US version." Seems the interface would not change.

Honestly, from what I can gather, the "US Version" was crufted up by YCA in an attempt to justify their MUCH higher prices. Last night, my local sales guy told me he was in Japan touring Yamaha factories last year. He said he could buy Clavinovas on the street for less than he pays wholesale - and he claimes his dealership is one of the largest Clavinova sellers in the country.

If I buy local (and I'm pretty inclined to do so) it will be for three reasons. First, because I've gotten a lot of value out of them. I've repeatedly gone into their store, and played their instruments. I've probably spent hours talking with them. That has value to me. Second, I have more confidence buying locally. And third, I won't want hassles should I need warranty service.

Is all that worth $1,700US or more? That's the quesiton I'm struggling with as I try to convince the local guys to give me a break. I know they can still make money at a much lower price - just not at the margins they would like.

Good luck with your decision. Please continue to share your shopping experience. When you mention you're considering buying a unit from overseas, where are you looking?

-Ross

[Sunny]

willjohn,
I am in the same quandary -- buying a 307 over the internet will save me US$1700 vs buying locally, but YCA won't cover the warranty if the Clav isn't from a local dealer, and I won't get the upgraded "USA Edition" software.

I'm not so sure if the so-called "USA Edition" is just being hyped up by the local dealer or not. My local dealer couldn't give me a straight answer on the differences. The only written response I received from YCA is: "The USA edition software is installed by the dealer. It adds color quadrant screens, new user voices, Music Finder with real song names and Hal Leonard Method Sampler".

I was also told by YCA that USA models are UL (Underwriters Laboratory) listed. Not so sure if the UL label is that meaningful though, since YC versions have voltage selector switch.

With regards to the "*Depending on the destination" items, I suspect that the 2HD/2DD Floppy Disk and/or the smart media slot might not be installed for some models shipped to certain countries. I looked at the 307 at a local dealer and I am positive that both items are installed for the US model.

Reading between the lines, I have a feeling that you might have been talking to the same guys in Florida (who claimed to be an importer of the CVPs). You being a Florida resident and closer to the CVP "wholesaler" in Florida, I wonder if you'd had the opportunity to check them out if they are indeed legit. I only have their contact names, phone numbers and their physical address, but I have no way of knowing if they actually have the models they claimed to have. Besides the warranty issue (which is a biggie) and the lack of the "USA edition" software, I am hesitant to send them money because they also have a bad rep (posted on http://www.consumeraffairs.com). But frankly, I was very tempted to buy from them because of the huge price savings.

I would appreciate it if you could share any insight you have about the "wholesaler" in Florida. You may send me a private message if you don't feel comfortable posting it publicly. I may do likewise if you're interested in knowing what I know about them...

[willjohn]

Thanks, Ross, for pointing out the additional USB port and addressing the song-list differences, which I should have mentioned. The song list difference is significant (at least YCA dealers would like us to think so).

Incidentally, it only recently came to my attention that there are 2 different song databases in a Clavinova: (1) a song database with songs that will play with accompaniment hands off and (2) a song-finder database with songs which setsup a selected song's time (e.g. 4/4), tempo, voices, and accompaniment. But, you must play the song (or a different one if you so choose) and make the appropriate chord changes.

As for Shaun's Florida "wholesaler", by private message we have confirmed we're talking to the same outfit. If there is anybody out there who has bought from a "Florida wholesaler", I'd love to hear from him/her via a posting or a private message.

Thanks.

John

[tomz17]

I've talked to the wholesaler from Florida (I'm pretty sure we are talking about the same guy).

I was initially looking for a 208. The first couple of e-mails were completely pointless. Finally, I got a quarter coherent reply, where he basically chastized me for even considering an older out of date model. (I'll post the e-mails from this guy when I get home, cuz they really are something). He told me that he doesn't have any more 208's in stock, and has "one more 206 that is reserved for sale". However, he's listed at least half a dozen more 206's on e-bay after that.

Furthermore, he wouldn't budge on price on the 307 ($5,000 shipped). While that is an awesome price comared to my local dealers (NY), I still discounted him because I was quoted a similar price from an authorized dealer in Canada (a few hours away).

Looking at the wholesaler's feedback, i don't doubt that you'll get your product if you order from them. I just didn't find that I had a completely pleasant interaction via e-mail. So I decided I would MUCH rather pay a few hundred dollars more in duties to get a piano from an authorized dealer in canada (who has helped out many other people on this forum) than deal with this outfit and their clearly grey market products.

I figure I have a halfway decent chance of getting yamaha USA to warranty an authorized piano from Canda. I have no chance in hell of getting them to warranty the products the "wholesaler" from Florida sells.


-Tom

P.S. This was a few weeks ago... Then I happened to come across this forum and bought the 209 from Fred....

:)

[CountJS]

FYI - Canadian Warranty is good is Canada only, so if it is a quick drive - no worries, however, YCA won't pick up the tab...

[Joe Harrington]

Please excuse if I got this in the wrong place. I didn't see much about the CVP-900. Is this a one-off or the same as the CVP-210 with different cabinet. The reason I ask is because I just saw the CVP-900 on e-bay for around $6,000. Can anyone give me a clue if this is worth the $$$ or do I go out and buy the CVP-309GP and make payments for sixty five years? Any feedback would be helpful.

Joe :)

[CountJS]

the CVP-900 is a grand version of the CVP-209...

[sablair]

I posted this under the "Music Finder" thread, but it really belongs in this thread.

As good timing would have it, my CVP 307 has just received the USAv3 upgrade, so I can very acurately describe what it consists of.

The upgrade includes:

-Color quadrant screen
-New User Voices
-Larger Music Finder File with Real song names (i.e."I Shot the Sheriff" instead of "Shooting the Sheriff")
-Hal Leonard Music Method Sampler

Here is the before and after pics of the screen:

http://home.pacbell.net/sablair/displayf.jpg
http://home.pacbell.net/sablair/displayusa.jpg

The Music Finder File contains a whopping 2314 songs

http://home.pacbell.net/sablair/MF307usa.txt
http://home.pacbell.net/sablair/307us.mfd


There are 46 new User Voices, including basses, guitars, organs, synths, and vintage. My favorite is the Melotron Flute (from the beginning of Strawberry Fields).

The HL sampler consists of 50 user songs to play along with, including some scale drills.

[jeffcarter]

Does anyone know how an existing 307 owner would get the latest version of sw (i.e v3)?

Also, how do you know what version you currently have?

Thanks in advance?

[CountJS]

sw? meaning, software? USA edition - from your dealer (in the US)... otherwise, there are not any updates that I am aware of... V2 of IDC will be available (FREE ~ firmware) late Feb...


...

[sablair]

To tell which version, when I go to either the new "Song" or "Voice" folders which were installed under the "User" tab, the folder is labeled "USAv3" in big letters.

I'm guessing that "v3" means it's for the CVP300 series. (v2 was probably for the CVP 200 series). So I wouldn't panic.

After doing some more thinking....and guessing....I'm thinking the "color quadrant" upgrade is simply created by loading a background bitmap image with the colors, just like you can load your own background pic, image, etc. as long as it's in bmp format. I believe it should be 640 x 360 to exactly fit the CVP 307 display.

Wouldn't it be fun to design and share various backgrounds? For instance, use the colors and patterns of your country's flag, but still maintain the "quadrant" boundaries.